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Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

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Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  Schuey on Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:40 pm

Well, it has been a long long time since I have posted or even had a blog here. I was sitting on the couch last night and said to Lisa "I think I'm going to go back and start a blog on 365". So, here I am again after not being around for a long time.

I guess more of my purpose for starting this is to hopefully document in more detail my training going forward. I love using Strava and TrainingPeaks but both of those only give me one side of the equation to my training.

What's on Tap for 2017? Two goal races 1. Boston in April 2. 100 miler in the fall. At this time my complete focus and attention is on the 2017 Boston Marathon. I just turned 45 this past Summer and have moved into yet another new age group. See this getting old thing isn't all that bad!!! I have some lofty goals for Boston this year but there is long way to go before I can really tell what will be a realistic. I will say that I went to beat my overall marathon PR. I really felt last year I was in great shape and no doubt ready to break my PR but came up a little short. Therefore, the chase to break it continues, will this be the year that I chase down my youth and prove that age is just a state of min? Only time will tell.

More to come, so if you are interested stay tune......
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  Mark B on Sat Oct 22, 2016 4:22 pm

Hey, you're back! Welcome, Schuey!

I think Strava is great, too, but there's nothing quite like the conversations and friendships that can develop through these forums.

Also, what 100-miler are you running?

Good luck in chasing your goal! I have a feeling you'll catch it. Very Happy

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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  ounce on Sat Oct 22, 2016 11:22 pm

Boy, you're getting old. pale 

I'm looking forward to reading about your journey on Boston.  I think we have somebody else around here that has run Boston a time or two. scratch
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  KBFitz on Sun Oct 23, 2016 10:15 am

Nice to see you here again old friend. I too like Strava, but like the community here even as it winds down. I'm looking forward to following your exploits moving forward and may even share the road with you somewhere over the horizon. Best regards to you & Lisa. Keep on keepin on.
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  Michele "1L" Keane on Sun Oct 23, 2016 7:40 pm

Nice to hear from you, Schuey and I'm happy that I will see you all in Boston again.  I, too, jump age groups this year - so we have something else in common.
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  nkrichards on Mon Oct 24, 2016 7:59 pm

Great to hear from you!  I won't be in Boston but will be looking forward to following your training and your race!!
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  T Miller on Thu Oct 27, 2016 7:28 pm

Hey Shuey, Good luck on your Boston training!  Which 100 are you running next fall?  Did you run Hallucination this year?
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  Schuey on Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:38 pm

Hi all and thank you everyone for the welcome back.

Mark and Tim, I will most likely being doing The Woodstock Hallucination this coming fall. Tim, no I didn't run it this year but I was signed up to do it. I was in great shape and ready to run it but had way to much going on with working on the plans for our house we are having built in Indiana. It took much longer for us to find land and then the process of going through the bank for our construction loan and converting that into a conventional loan. 

Finally in September we found 1.60 acres of land in the country (about 6 miles from downtown Valparaiso) and closed on that. Then the work with the our builder for the permits, well, and septic design started and finally just last week we closed on the construction loan/conventional loan. Looks like they will start to dig and lay the foundation by the end of November. Really looking forward to moving into our house sometime between May and late June.

So, the stress levels were up and plus I figured that since I wasn't going to be able to do WS this coming summer if I got in I figured to take this year off from doing the 100. Trust me it is back on the schedule for next year and the following year I'm thinking about doing 2 100s.

By the way good luck in your 100 in November and get that WS qualifier!!
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  Schuey on Mon Oct 31, 2016 10:09 pm

Alright we are now 24 weeks out from Boston, which also marks the start of my Boston training. As of now I have decided to take a little different approach to my marathon training this year. I have choose to take the outline to how I have trained for my 100 miler that I didn't do this past fall. I really like the structure of it and feel that it is worth giving it a shot at a marathon training cycle. It will require jogging around the approach of the workouts from a 100 miler to a marathon but I still think that structure and concepts apply and can possible get me over the top of what I'm trying to achieve this coming spring. Plus I feel that it will also give me a good bases to then transition into my 100 training after a brief break. 

Right now in theory here is how I'm looking to layout my 24 weeks of training:

7 weeks (weeks 1-7) VO2max (Running Intervals (RI))
8 weeks (weeks 8-15) Lactate Threshold (TempoRuns (TR)) the one adjustment I might make during this phase is adding some strength running workouts. Still haven't decided but will cross that bridge when I get there.
8 weeks (weeks 16-23) Endurance (SteadyStateRuns (SSR))
1 week (week 24) Peak 

Note that from the start of the program I will be doing Long Runs with them increasing over the training cycle. Earlier on in the cycle I will work more on some of Boston weakness and will work my Boston strengths later in the cycle. Good thing is I pretty much now these pretty well since I have been running this darn race for the last 10 years.

Week 1 Training schedule:

Monday: Easy Run (ER)

Tuesday: Running Intervals (RI) 8x600 w/400 recovery (also warm up and cool down)
              Recovery Run (RR)

Wednesday: ER
                   ER

Thursday: RI 8x600 w/400 recovery (also warm up and cool down)
               RR

Friday: ER
           ER

Saturday: RI 6x800 w/400 recovery (also warm up and cool down)
               RR

Sunday: ER (Long Run)


Today ended up being an 10 ER @ 7:28 pace.
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  Mark B on Tue Nov 01, 2016 10:41 am

That's an interesting approach. Schuey. It's sort of turning Lydiard's classic training pyramid on its head.

It's sort of but not quite like what McMillan suggested a few years ago. Is that what you're going for? I've toyed with adding harder workouts sooner as I train, and I've noticed it seems to help make the easy runs more efficient and a bit faster.

I'll be watching your training with interest to see how it works out.

Very cool about the new house, BTW! Feel free to share house plans, construction photos, etc. It'd be fun to watch it going up!

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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  Schuey on Tue Nov 01, 2016 12:08 pm

Hey Mark I think since I have always done things the conventional way for so many years I have been looking to do things differential. Yes, McMillan did discuss the concept of putting speed early in the training plan. I can't remember everything that he said about and the reason why. I would have to go back and dig up that article (which I do have stashed somewhere).

Here is the logic/approach that I was looking by doing this.

- Work on and develop the least specific physiology furthest away from the race. So, in the case of training for a marathon to me VO2max is the least important thing. If I was training for a 5k to 15k then developing my VO2max would be more specific and more important. From things I have read and looking at other research this seems to make logically sense.

- Work on and develop the most specific physiology closest to the race. In the case of the marathon I believe that Steady State Runs (which in essence are pretty much a MP run, just slightly faster) and Long Runs are the most important. Yes, as I mentioned earlier I will be doing long runs throughout the whole cycle but will put even more focus on them during the last 8 weeks. Will also start to put even more focus on downhill running later in the training cycle. 

I also think it makes sense to have the 3 important cycles (VO2max, LT, and Endurance). There is no doubt that all 3 are very important to one another and each builds on one another.. It just that one is less important than the other depending on the race. Good point that read on this is that "being the least important should not be confused with being unimportant!"

I have also have planned for the VO2max phase to be 7 weeks but in reality it could be shorter. So, I may decide at some point later to maybe shorten this phase to 4 or 5 weeks and tack more time spent on the other two phases. 

Further to this I would be looking and monitoring certain things to help give me guidance that change is needed and appropriate. Such things as CTL (cumulative training load), ATL (acute training load), TSB (training stress balance), and occurs my own body/mental signals.
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  Schuey on Tue Nov 01, 2016 10:22 pm

Today was VO2max and then a recovery run. Due to my late start I was only able to get in my VO2max run, which to be honest was fine with me.

VO2max workout plan 6x600 with 400 jog between.

I will start by saying this workout really put she's my current limits today. I started to feel the toughness of this workout med way through the 3rd interval and by time I got to 6th one I was cooked hence the slow down. Overall I give myself an A for the workout and very satisfied with it.

Easy warm up for 4 miles

Intervals
#1 1:49 (4:52 pace)
#2 1:52 (5:00 pace)
#3 1:52 (5:00 pace)
#4 1:50 (4:55 pace)
#5 1:51 (4:58 pace)
#6 1:54 (5:06 pace)

Plan for tomorrow double easy runs. Will see if I stick to that or make it Recovery runs with the same VO2max workout on tap for Thursday.
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Re: Long Distance Runner, What You Standin' There For?

Post  nkrichards on Wed Nov 02, 2016 5:48 pm

This is going to be fun!  I hope you continue to share your training philosophy along with your actual training runs.

Glad you joined us again...
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