Suspension?

Did James Harrison deserve a suspension for his hit on Colt McCoy?

No, the "No Fun League" does not let the players play anymore. Quarterbacks are so protected that if you look at them wrong, you will get a penalty called on you. It was a big hit, but honestly the speed of the game is so fast.

Did you see the unecessary roughness call on London Fletcher against Tom Brady? Brady went into a late slide and fletcher hit him with his shouder in Brady's midsection. Fletcher got called for an elbow to the head, when his elbow was nowhere near Brady's head. The hit was completely legal...

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d824ef8ff/article/redskins-lb-fletcher-livid-over-roughing-call-for-hit-on-brady

Agreed. If it was Vick, there would be no call.... But Brady's "zone of protection" is about as big as Greg Maddux's strike zone...

I say yes - change the rules if you disagree. You have to protect the QBs and IMO it was clearly helmet to helmet.

Jack_Scaff wrote:I say yes - change the rules if you disagree. You have to protect the QBs and IMO it was clearly helmet to helmet.

It may have been helmet to helmet, but I do not believe that it was intentional.

Wait, there was helmet to helmet contact in that clip (link that Nick posted)? I... don't see it. At all.

Oh. Derp. Maybe I should reread the thread before commenting on a video that's unrelated to it. Or finish my coffee first.

Suspension or not, I'm in the camp that wants to start paring down the padding in football and hockey. It's like the fat cushiony heels on running shoes - there's an illusion that they're protective, so you're less careful of what's hitting what. That said, the research I've found suggests that while concussions are on the rise since the changes made to helmets, fatal head injuries have dropped. Shrug.

Unintentional contact in both instances.

Since when did quarterbacks become pretty princesses who must be protected from getting their hair mussed or uniform dirty? (No offense to the princesses out there...)

Anyway, this thread made me look for some REAL contact.



Now THAT's more like it.

Nick Morris wrote:

Jack_Scaff wrote:I say yes - change the rules if you disagree. You have to protect the QBs and IMO it was clearly helmet to helmet.

It may have been helmet to helmet, but I do not believe that it was intentional.

I answered yes. Doesn't matter if it was intentional, it was easily avoidable. Harrison does this crap all the time. His reputation precedes him. I believe he does these things intentionally at this point.

I hate the "defenseless receiver" rule, it's anti-football. But the helmet to helmet rule is a good one, especially like this situation where it was avoidable. Maybe coaches will start teaching kids to tackle the right way.

Mark B wrote:Unintentional contact in both instances.

Since when did quarterbacks become pretty princesses who must be protected from getting their hair mussed or uniform dirty? (No offense to the princesses out there...)

These guys get absolutely slaughtered every week, yet they are princesses? There has definitely been some poor rule enforcement, but QBs play just about the most dangerous position in all of sports.

Bad call. The QB left the pocket and was assumed to be running the football. At that point the defense wants to 1) tackle him and 2) knock the ball free. Harrison did not use his helmet as a weapon in the tackle. He was lined straight into McCoy's breastplate. The contact was the top of the helmet to the underside of the face guard. McCoy put himself in that position and Harrison levelled him by making the initial point of contact above the center of gravity. That's football. The responsibility for protecting the quarterback starts with the offensive line and ends with QBs own decision-making. The refs should only call flagrant violations. In my opinion, that was just a great defensive play.

Mr MattM wrote:Bad call. The QB left the pocket and was assumed to be running the football. At that point the defense wants to 1) tackle him and 2) knock the ball free. Harrison did not use his helmet as a weapon in the tackle. He was lined straight into McCoy's breastplate. The contact was the top of the helmet to the underside of the face guard. McCoy put himself in that position and Harrison levelled him by making the initial point of contact above the center of gravity. That's football. The responsibility for protecting the quarterback starts with the offensive line and ends with QBs own decision-making. The refs should only call flagrant violations. In my opinion, that was just a great defensive play.

Completely disagree. He did use the top of his helmet as a weapon. It was easily avoidable, he could have crushed him without going high at all. His goal wasn't to tackle McCoy, though, it was hit him high - and he did.

Mr MattM wrote: In my opinion, that was just a great defensive play.

Good play or not, they have to follow the rule...

The N.F.L. explained the ruling
that was made on the field Thursday night: “When a passer is outside
the pocket area as in the case of Cleveland quarterback Colt McCoy last
night, he is still afforded the protection of Rule 12, Section 2,
Article 13 (3), which prohibits defensive players from using their
helmet against a passer who is in a defenseless posture, including by
‘forcibly hitting the passer’s head or neck area with the helmet or
facemask, regardless of whether the defensive player also uses his arms
to tackle the passer by encircling or grasping him.’”

As I said earlier, I think the CALL was right - I also personally think the rule is appropriate, but that is a matter of opinion.

Yes.

If this was a first time offender, a fine would have been sufficient. But Harrison has been punished for using his helmet as a human missle numerous and has shown no remorse. The fines levied against him to date amount to 2% of his salary, and thus have had no deterrent effect.

I get that the NFL protects its QBs, but this is simply a matter of poor tackling. There's no need for a defender to launch into a player like that. In fact, I'm in the camp that the improved helmets contribute to more concussions, because it allows players like Harrison to use it as a weapon. Put on a leather helmet and try that crap.

The Browns need all the help they can get.

Dave-O wrote:I'm in the camp that the improved helmets contribute to more concussions, because it allows players like Harrison to use it as a weapon. Put on a leather helmet and try that crap.

Good point.

In fact, why don't they just ditch the protective equipment altogether and play it rugby-style?

Dave-O wrote:There's no need for a defender to launch into a player like that.

That was hardly a 'launch'. Looked to me like Harrison actually pulled up a bit right before contact and McCoy went full speed into the contact. It was a love tap, at best. Wimpy-assed QBs need to grow a pair.

Mark B wrote:

Dave-O wrote:I'm in the camp that the improved helmets contribute to more concussions, because it allows players like Harrison to use it as a weapon. Put on a leather helmet and try that crap.

Good point.

In fact, why don't they just ditch the protective equipment altogether and play it rugby-style?

+1

Mr MattM wrote:

Dave-O wrote:There's no need for a defender to launch into a player like that.

That was hardly a 'launch'. Looked to me like Harrison actually pulled up a bit right before contact and McCoy went full speed into the contact. It was a love tap, at best. Wimpy-assed QBs need to grow a pair.

Does the fact that McCoy has no memory of the play affect your opinion at all? I'm in the camp that due to repeat offenses and complete and total lack of remorse, Harrison deserves whatever the NFL dishes out and probably more. He's honestly actively trying to hurt people. What he does is probably worse than going for a guy's knees because the damage doesn't necessarily rear it's ugly head for another 15-20 years.

mul21 wrote:

Mr MattM wrote:

Dave-O wrote:There's no need for a defender to launch into a player like that.

That was hardly a 'launch'. Looked to me like Harrison actually pulled up a bit right before contact and McCoy went full speed into the contact. It was a love tap, at best. Wimpy-assed QBs need to grow a pair.

Does the fact that McCoy has no memory of the play affect your opinion at all? I'm in the camp that due to repeat offenses and complete and total lack of remorse, Harrison deserves whatever the NFL dishes out and probably more. He's honestly actively trying to hurt people. What he does is probably worse than going for a guy's knees because the damage doesn't necessarily rear it's ugly head for another 15-20 years.

He doesn't remember it because it was hardly memorable. I like the drama. That's football! Gotta have the ferocious defenders to keep the game interesting. Now, I'm not talking about the Suh-type rage where a guy's head gets slammed into the ground and his arm intentionally stepped on... I'm talking about the guy that will hit you... HARD... if you aren't good enough to angle away from him. I get the argument that Harrison has a history, but I still don't see evidence that he 'launched' into McCoy's head. McCoy came straight into his contact point and went 'head down' just as they collided. Next time, I suggest he get out of the way... Harrison is going to HIT YOU HARD. If the dude's worried about his noggin, find a different career. Football isn't supposed to be candyland.

Look very closely at the ESPN replays. He deliberately puts his head down just as he is going to hit McCoy. He's been taught to do this, and has done this numerous times. The suspension was not nearly enough. If he was on any other team besides the Steelers, he would have had a 3 game suspension. Folks use the speed-of-the-game argument. That's BS. I guarantee that Harrison knows that he can get away with hitting someone squarely and lowering his head at the last minute. I'd be interested to see how other players from his HS and college tackle. I bet they have similar techniques.

As a physician, I am appalled that the Browns staff did not do a better job of evaluating McCoy. Same for Michael Vick--he was cleared too soon at the start of the season and played horribly(4 TO's) the next game because he hadn't recovered from the concussion. Miminum time for return to play according to all of our current guidelines is one week. He was symptom free for only a few days and played 5.25 days after the concussion.



On a side note, I'd love to see Marshawn Lynch get a crack at Harrison. He'd blow him up.

Mr MattM wrote:

He doesn't remember it because it was hardly memorable. I like the drama. That's football! Gotta have the ferocious defenders to keep the game interesting. Now, I'm not talking about the Suh-type rage where a guy's head gets slammed into the ground and his arm intentionally stepped on... I'm talking about the guy that will hit you... HARD... if you aren't good enough to angle away from him. I get the argument that Harrison has a history, but I still don't see evidence that he 'launched' into McCoy's head. McCoy came straight into his contact point and went 'head down' just as they collided. Next time, I suggest he get out of the way... Harrison is going to HIT YOU HARD. If the dude's worried about his noggin, find a different career. Football isn't supposed to be candyland.

ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED!

Dave-O wrote:

Mr MattM wrote:

He doesn't remember it because it was hardly memorable. I like the drama. That's football! Gotta have the ferocious defenders to keep the game interesting. Now, I'm not talking about the Suh-type rage where a guy's head gets slammed into the ground and his arm intentionally stepped on... I'm talking about the guy that will hit you... HARD... if you aren't good enough to angle away from him. I get the argument that Harrison has a history, but I still don't see evidence that he 'launched' into McCoy's head. McCoy came straight into his contact point and went 'head down' just as they collided. Next time, I suggest he get out of the way... Harrison is going to HIT YOU HARD. If the dude's worried about his noggin, find a different career. Football isn't supposed to be candyland.

ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED!

Can't make a comment like that and not post a link to the scene! And as good as it is, the "My Name Is Maximus" one below might be even better. If I had a son, I think I would have to name him Maximus Decimus Meridius McKee.

http://movieclips.com/vs4A-gladiator-movie-are-you-not-entertained/

ps Harrison is a serial repeat offender who seemingly IS trying to injure people out there. He needs to be suspended. Would be different if it was someone without his history but like Suh now, Harrison's past actions should be part of the decision.

This isn't Jack Tatum's NFL.