Make No Little Plans

mul21 wrote:Do you know what the capital of Djibouti is?

Spoiler:

I like that Spoiler button feature. Very cool. No, I definitely did not know the capital of Djibouti. I was the Beavis & Butthead guys snickering the whole time on the call thinking "they said G-Booty"

That's damn fast, Chris. I can't imagine going sub-5 on flat ground. My legs just don't move like that.

I only heard about that place yesterday - some article in the WSJ about drones and how they could land in that place (I can't spell it) if they couldn't make it back to the carrier or Diego Garcia or wherever they're launched from, because we have an airbase there.

I never heard of it previously. What was it called when I was in 5th grade - Flemish East Africa?

Nice set of repeats there Chris.

I ran 400s the other day too.

I have a 5k coming up this weekend so I didn't want to do too much.

I ran the first 4 in 79 77 77 78
Then I decided to take it easy for 4 more at my dream 5k pace 83 83 80 82. This pace felt too hard for a 5k but I was on tired legs so me and my wishful thinking is hoping that it is more comfortable after a couple days of rest.

I think we're pretty close in the speed department.

Michael Enright wrote:I only heard about that place yesterday - some article in the WSJ about drones and how they could land in that place (I can't spell it) if they couldn't make it back to the carrier or Diego Garcia or wherever they're launched from, because we have an airbase there.

I never heard of it previously. What was it called when I was in 5th grade - Flemish East Africa?

Yup, because of where it is located geographically, there is a TON (literally hundreds of thousands) of US personnel in country there. And they need some big giant data connections for video streams etc. which is where my company comes in. Pretty fascinating area of the world - but like you, I had never even heard of the country until very recently.

T Miller wrote:Nice set of repeats there Chris.

I ran 400s the other day too.

I have a 5k coming up this weekend so I didn't want to do too much.

I ran the first 4 in 79 77 77 78
Then I decided to take it easy for 4 more at my dream 5k pace 83 83 80 82. This pace felt too hard for a 5k but I was on tired legs so me and my wishful thinking is hoping that it is more comfortable after a couple days of rest.

I think we're pretty close in the speed department.

Yeah, right! I could pace you in your 5K....for about 1k! 5:48 is my dreak 5K pace right now. I'd love to break under 18:00. I would need a really really good day to do it but I feel like I'm in that ballpark once I get done with this marathon stuff. My PR is currently 18:26 although I think I can definitely lower that. You are talking more down in the 5:35-5:30 range and that's out of reach for me right now. I can feel by the end of each 400 that I would be blowing apart to keep going too much longer. Good luck in the race this weekend.

Chris M wrote:

mul21 wrote:Do you know what the capital of Djibouti is?

Spoiler:

I like that Spoiler button feature. Very cool. No, I definitely did not know the capital of Djibouti. I was the Beavis & Butthead guys snickering the whole time on the call thinking "they said G-Booty"

Hmm, I was thinking about Big John Booty from Buckaroo Banzai.

After doing a bit of reading, it sounds like Al Qaeda is there, too, thanks to the Somali refugee influx over the years.



Nice 400's Tim and Chris.

Chris M wrote:

Michael Enright wrote:I only heard about that place yesterday - some article in the WSJ about drones and how they could land in that place (I can't spell it) if they couldn't make it back to the carrier or Diego Garcia or wherever they're launched from, because we have an airbase there.

I never heard of it previously. What was it called when I was in 5th grade - Flemish East Africa?

I had never even heard of the country until very recently.

I guess you guys didn't follow marathoning in the late 80s/early 90s.


Ahmed Salah

Matt W wrote:

Chris M wrote:

Michael Enright wrote:I only heard about that place yesterday - some article in the WSJ about drones and how they could land in that place (I can't spell it) if they couldn't make it back to the carrier or Diego Garcia or wherever they're launched from, because we have an airbase there.

I never heard of it previously. What was it called when I was in 5th grade - Flemish East Africa?

I had never even heard of the country until very recently.

I guess you guys didn't follow marathoning in the late 80s/early 90s.


Ahmed Salah

Nope, I didn't particularly, just in a very aloof sort of way, I guess.

Oh, and Ahmed Salah to you, as well!

I guess that means peach and love...

Chicago Training cycle in the books after today's 20 miler. Now I do 2 weeks of taper. Did today as a pretty aggressive progression run, starting quite relaxed well north of 8:00 pace but working it down into the mid 7s pretty quickly from there and finishing with the last 10 all under 7:00. I feel good. Ready for some rest and taper but definitely 100% injury free right now. I'll sharpen over these next 2 weeks, try and move down another couple of pounds so I can run Chicago in the high 150s (I'm 5'10" and usually in the low to mid 160s but I run best at 159 or better), get the pacing plan straight with Dave and make sure my Sherpa Man Schuey is on board, catch up fully on sleep and rest and then be ready to go mentally and physically for October 9 in Chicago. There's certainly a different nutrition plan already in place via all the supplments (mostly just sodium) I now take and will take race day so I'm hoping the crushing cramps of Chicago and Boston won't be back. Hard to tell as they certainly haven't reared their ugly head in any training this cycle but the raced marathon itself is always different. But at least a different approach is being taken and the doc who put it together seems confident it will help. I guess the biggest X Factor is weather. I'm a cold weather racer and all of my best runs/races are done at temps well below 60 degrees. Philly last weekend was perfect for me with the temps in the mid to low 50s. In fact for the marathon, I would prefer it even cooler than that. I don't like my chances of Sub3 in temps over 70 for the whole race. What would be hard to pull the trigger on doing but I should is that if it does look like it will be a hot weather day, I run Chicago as a long run and then do a race like Philly in November as my goal marathon. We'll see but if the weather does look bad, that's the right call for me. If the cool temps we all hope for are there, then it is game on and I feel good to go.

Chris:
I'm a cool weather racer too. Above about 60 degs, I'm toast.

Your training seems to match your goal. Knock it out of the park.

Chris, you have had such an excellent training cycle and year. You will absolutely drill it this year if weather permits. If the Northern loop is windy again, be careful not to push too hard in the first 7-8 miles.

Sunday
2011-10-09

High temp: 53 F 11 C Low temp: 34 F 1 C

Partly cloudy and unseasonably cool


Just found this. I'll take it!

Nice training cycle, including some good races and race training runs in there Chris. I have a feeling this is your breakout year. Philly registration is 95% full so any back up race, unless entered now, may be at risk. The thing is , it's been unseasonable cool around Chicago for several weeks. This week is warming up so let's hope it's a prelude to cold temps the week after.

Chris, enjoy your taper and pat yourself on the back for a great training cycle!
I hope that unseasonably cool weather forecast holds!

So, is it time to start discussing pacing strategy? Or should I discuss with Mr. Schumacher directly?

Dave-O wrote:So, is it time to start discussing pacing strategy? Or should I discuss with Mr. Schumacher directly?

Let's discuss....I've been thinking of a 6:50 overall pace target rather than the 6:53 that is 2:59:59 on the nose. Certainly I don't want to go too fast but I do have a little fear of needing to be exactly on and with no cushion in that final 10K.



I'll throw out a straw man idea.....2 7:00 miles to open the race...6:50s the rest of the way.....done exactly on target I believe that would be a 2:59:20. I've been comfortable at 6:45 as my training MP but 6:50 just "feels" so much easier. But I'm open to some 6:45 target miles in there as well.



I will need some convincing on starting slower than 7:00s. Scares me to be too far in the hole pace-wise early on.



But to be clear, the goal is only sub 3:00. Not leaving open the chance for a faster time and not preserving myself for some time over 3:00. All in for the 2:XX and as close as you want to cut it to 2:59:59 works for me.

You can just take the WR pace and scale down.

Chris M wrote:
Let's discuss....I've been thinking of a 6:50 overall pace target rather than the 6:53 that is 2:59:59 on the nose. Certainly I don't want to go too fast but I do have a little fear of needing to be exactly on and with no cushion in that final 10K.

I'll throw out a straw man idea.....2 7:00 miles to open the race...6:50s the rest of the way.....done exactly on target I believe that would be a 2:59:20. I've been comfortable at 6:45 as my training MP but 6:50 just "feels" so much easier. But I'm open to some 6:45 target miles in there as well.

I will need some convincing on starting slower than 7:00s. Scares me to be too far in the hole pace-wise early on.

But to be clear, the goal is only sub 3:00. Not leaving open the chance for a faster time and not preserving myself for some time over 3:00. All in for the 2:XX and as close as you want to cut it to 2:59:59 works for me.

We're on the same page....mostly.

I will suggest 4 7:00's to start the race. That way you're still less than a minute behind pace, but it ensures a slow start. I know that will be difficult, but that's what Schuey is for.

Between mile 5 and 20, I want as many miles as possible between 6:45-6:50. Like clockwork. That way you're slightly under goal pace, but I've had you training closer to 6:45 than 6:53 anyway, and I'm confident you could run a marathon in a 6:45 pace.

For the last 10k, there are no rules. I trust you and Schuey will know what pace to run based on how you feel.

We'll adjust depending on wind direction, but I would really love to see more than two 7:00 miles to start. It will pay off. Trust me.

[quote="Dave-O"]

Chris M wrote:
We'll adjust depending on wind direction, but I would really love to see more than two 7:00 miles to start. It will pay off. Trust me.

I agree with this...definitely do more than 2 miles at 7 minute pace and I'd say to make sure that they are 7 or slower. You want those first 3-4 miles to be absolutely effortless. Believe me, you won't lose your sub 3 hour marathon because you ran 20 seconds slow on your 3rd mile. It just doesn't work like that.

[quote="GregC"]

Dave-O wrote:

Chris M wrote:
We'll adjust depending on wind direction, but I would really love to see more than two 7:00 miles to start. It will pay off. Trust me.

I agree with this...definitely do more than 2 miles at 7 minute pace and I'd say to make sure that they are 7 or slower. You want those first 3-4 miles to be absolutely effortless. Believe me, you won't lose your sub 3 hour marathon because you ran 20 seconds slow on your 3rd mile. It just doesn't work like that.

Shoot, that does it....I'm agreeing to anything Greg and Dave are in accord on regarding Chicago pacing.



Lock it in and I'm writing it here to confirm it - my first 4 miles, no mile is 6:XX.



It will be very hard on me. But I have seen in a number of races and workouts that the slow start that is so difficult for me to force myself to do DOES pay off.



By the way, I didn't know how to find my Chicago bib number. In another thread, Dave posted his number. I went to the Chicago site and was able to confirm that I'm a registered runner but it did not show my bib number. How do I figure that out?

You have to look at your participant guide they sent you I think. I'm like 2547 or 2647, but don't remember and my guide is at home.

mul21 wrote:You have to look at your participant guide they sent you I think. I'm like 2547 or 2647, but don't remember and my guide is at home.

Ah, the thing with the old geezers on the front of it. I was wondering if they were thinking I should be running back a few corrals with those distinguished "young at heart" guys.

I like the strategy, Chris. Make sure you hit the mile 4 fluid station(2 cups) before you crank it up. I'm sitting here laughing about how slooowww that first mile is going to feel for you. You'll be able to recite the Declaration of Independence in between breaths.

[quote="GregC"]

Dave-O wrote:

Chris M wrote:
We'll adjust depending on wind direction, but I would really love to see more than two 7:00 miles to start. It will pay off. Trust me.

I agree with this...definitely do more than 2 miles at 7 minute pace and I'd say to make sure that they are 7 or slower. You want those first 3-4 miles to be absolutely effortless. Believe me, you won't lose your sub 3 hour marathon because you ran 20 seconds slow on your 3rd mile. It just doesn't work like that.

I would have to agree with what Dave and Greg have said also. I don't worry or be scared about losing the sub 3 by running slower the first 3 to 4 miles. If you go back and look at my splits from Boston the first time I ran a sub 3 and this last time sub 2:50 I ran my first mile 20 seconds slower and the next 3 anywhere from 8 to 10 seconds slower.

Dave is right I'm there to help keep things effortless at the start and keep you under control and then help with building your confidence during the middle stages.

With the shape you are in and if we do this thing the right way don't be surprised if we come in around 2:55:xx to 2:57:xx! No pressure I'm just saying you are in that good of shape, it is just now up to having everything fall into place on race day. Remember my goal going into Boston in 2010 was just like you 2:59:59 and I just let it happen and came in at 2:55.

Also you are trained to run at a 6:45 pace so those miles closer to 6:45 will make-up the time for the slower miles.

I have enough confidence in my ability to help you adjust late in the race due to the wind and etc.. I'm sure with you awesome training and my knowledge of being in this position in the past that I can help you push through in the late stages of the race.

You got this man just time to relax and for us but to execute the plan Dave puts out there for us. I'm your rabbit and my job is to get you to the finish line at your goal time. Just believe in this and it will happen, nothing to worry about Dave and Greg know what they are talking about they have been there and done it many times before in the past.