Re: JFK Registration Opens Today

mountandog Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:36 pm

wrichman wrote:
T Miller wrote:
mountandog wrote:still don't see any team info.

Question from you experts: After Chicago in 2 weeks, how do I need to train for this thing? I've never done an ultra and I'm lost for this. I figure I'll give Chi a good go so I'll have the usual post-marathon soreness and tenderness and but I'm a bit short on my usual mileage due to injury. So, do I get right back on the saddle, reverse taper, back to back 20s in a couple of weeks? I've got no clue.
I'm pretty clueless as well but I would probably do a reverse taper and focus on back to back long runs once you're recovered. For my last 50, I tried to get a number of, 3?, back to back runs that totaled my race distance. I think part of your focus for these long runs should be balancing pace and nutrition so that you can keep your energy up for the duration.
I agree with Tim. 5 weeks between - assuming you feel ok within a week after Chicago, try and fit in at least one 20/20 or 30/20 back to back long run IF you have previously done B2B runs. If not, then don't add it in. Instead, do one longer time on your feet run 5-6 hours/roughly 30-35 miles slower paced ideally on some on trail. 3 weeks out from 50 miler. Do an easy 20 miles 2 weeks out, then 10 a week before. Also be ready for the steep inclines in the first 5.5 miles - you may want to do some walking on treadmill @ 12% incline and switch to running, then alternate. I did that for one of my 20 milers. It was a long session, but worth it.

A word of advice to all of you running this year - take walk breaks, even just 10-30 seconds, in the first 2.5 up the mountain. Don't let the road or your tapered legs fool you - it'll take it's toll on you later in the race. I ran/walked up the mountain to the trail in the first 2.5 and watched tons of people run up the whole way...only to pass at least 150 of them in the second half of the race.

I have a race report from last year if anyone wants to read it - I think I posted it last year on this site.

So I just re-read your race report from last yr. Don't know whether to be intimidated or inspired. So - what did you take for the race - all I can see is an extra pair of shoes. Did you need to change clothes at all as the day warmed? I have no clue what preparations I need to have or items to bring. Kevin and Michele said they'd help crew, so I assume that means we give them our crap and they haul it around for us? Help y'all > I couldn't even get to the starting line in Chicago on time. Give me some pointers on the race stuff itself. I'll take care of getting in shape - but ???????? affraid

Schuey Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:31 pm

mountandog wrote:
So I just re-read your race report from last yr. Don't know whether to be intimidated or inspired. So - what did you take for the race - all I can see is an extra pair of shoes. Did you need to change clothes at all as the day warmed? I have no clue what preparations I need to have or items to bring. Kevin and Michele said they'd help crew, so I assume that means we give them our crap and they haul it around for us? Help y'all > I couldn't even get to the starting line in Chicago on time. Give me some pointers on the race stuff itself. I'll take care of getting in shape - but ????????

When I ran this it was 32 degrees at the start and warmed up to 50 something. Basically I took off my pre race war ups at the start and handed it to Lisa. There is no fenced I. Area at the start like marathons. When I started I had on my gloves, hat and arm Warner's and wore a singlet. By mile 26 I handed Lisa my hat and gloves. So there was no change of cloths. E en though there are plenty aid stations I still carried my own water bottle and gels since I use hammer products. At certain points of the race Lisa and Kevin would hand me a new bottle filled and more gels and other items that I take for fuel at these given points.

For me I don't think it is any different then a marathon other then it being longer and you must fuel more cause of the distance. I would also suggest that you make sure to take in protein during the race and not just carbs. Again my source of protein comes from hammer products. This weekend I will try to post more about what my fueling plan is for this years race. This is very very important do to the length and time you will be using energy for a much longer time frame.

wrichman Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:51 pm

Schuey wrote:
mountandog wrote:
So I just re-read your race report from last yr. Don't know whether to be intimidated or inspired. So - what did you take for the race - all I can see is an extra pair of shoes. Did you need to change clothes at all as the day warmed? I have no clue what preparations I need to have or items to bring. Kevin and Michele said they'd help crew, so I assume that means we give them our crap and they haul it around for us? Help y'all > I couldn't even get to the starting line in Chicago on time. Give me some pointers on the race stuff itself. I'll take care of getting in shape - but ????????
When I ran this it was 32 degrees at the start and warmed up to 50 something. Basically I took off my pre race war ups at the start and handed it to Lisa. There is no fenced I. Area at the start like marathons. When I started I had on my gloves, hat and arm Warner's and wore a singlet. By mile 26 I handed Lisa my hat and gloves. So there was no change of cloths. E en though there are plenty aid stations I still carried my own water bottle and gels since I use hammer products. At certain points of the race Lisa and Kevin would hand me a new bottle filled and more gels and other items that I take for fuel at these given points.

For me I don't think it is any different then a marathon other then it being longer and you must fuel more cause of the distance. I would also suggest that you make sure to take in protein during the race and not just carbs. Again my source of protein comes from hammer products. This weekend I will try to post more about what my fueling plan is for this years race. This is very very important do to the length and time you will be using energy for a much longer time frame.

I agree with Schuey about wearing the same clothes. It was roughly the same weather last year - I think 28 degrees at the start, mid 50s at the finish. I was freezing at the start, but warmed up quickly within a few miles of the race. I wore short sleeves, arm sleeves, gloves, cap or headband/ear warmer (can't remember which one), shorts, calf sleeves. I wore my arm sleeves to mile 27 and gave them to my mom. I probably had a LS and extra gloves (in case I got sweaty) in the bag my mom had. My mom had a bunch of supplies in the bag I gave her - body glide, vaseline, blister kit, extra socks, tums, 2nd Surge gels, favorite drink, sunglasses, etc. My shorts had 3 pockets, so I could carry 2 gels, salt tabs, ginger chews (for upset stomach), inhaler, Midol. I didn't take anything besides water and gatorade from the aid stations - mostly b/c I didn't stop and had my own nutrition. I don't eat nearly as much as most people do in races, but I try and eat something little every 30-60 minutes. For example, I eat one gel over the last 8 miles of a marathon and that works for me....so in a 50 I get by with a few gels and some chocolate covered espresso beans or peanut M&Ms.
oh, the start is easy - just get to the high school early enough - like an hour before to be there for the pre-race talk and use the bathroom. every one just walks to the start about 1/2 mile and then a gun goes off and you go.
any more specific questions, feel free to ask

mountandog Tue Oct 29, 2013 9:05 pm

so I'm up to 40 mile weeks since the Chicago Marathon. Not sure I can yet do a long run. I wanted to do something like 15/25 this weekend (my longest is 12/20), but I'm still not fully recovered and JFK is only 3 weeks out. Am I toast? Any recommendations for workouts the last 3 weeks?

Mark B Tue Oct 29, 2013 9:56 pm

mountandog wrote:so I'm up to 40 mile weeks since the Chicago Marathon. Not sure I can yet do a long run. I wanted to do something like 15/25 this weekend (my longest is 12/20), but I'm still not fully recovered and JFK is only 3 weeks out. Am I toast? Any recommendations for workouts the last 3 weeks?

I'd suggest not sweating it and tapering. You'll be better off slightly undertrained and fresh than overtrained and wrung-out. No one workout you can do this close to JFK is going to help you, and there are plenty of them that can hurt you. The odds favor taper.

wrichman Tue Oct 29, 2013 10:02 pm

mountandog wrote:so I'm up to 40 mile weeks since the Chicago Marathon. Not sure I can yet do a long run. I wanted to do something like 15/25 this weekend (my longest is 12/20), but I'm still not fully recovered and JFK is only 3 weeks out. Am I toast? Any recommendations for workouts the last 3 weeks?

I would do a SLOW 25-30ish miler (or 5 hours time on your feet run/walk) this weekend (but that's just what I would do). By running and walking, you can spend a lot of time on your feet without too much intensity or taxing your body.

I've never been fully recovered from long races/training runs during training for a 50 or more race. In my experience, training on tired legs (but NOT injured legs) = how you'll feel the last 10-15 miles of the 50 M. Good mental training as well b/c you teach yourself to push through the fatigue and negative voices.

Then do 10 easy a week out. Add in a few maintenance runs up to 10 miles, maybe 1-2 runs w/ a few faster (like MP) miles thrown in to remind your legs that you can run fast.

You'll likely do some walking and it may be more painful than if you had a few more long runs, but you can finish the race. Just my 2 cents.

KBFitz Sat Nov 02, 2013 5:41 pm

Now posted on the JFK 50 Mile home page http://www.jfk50mile.org/:

Team Declarations are now being accepted.

Want to declare a team? If so, who wants to be Captain?

mountandog Sun Nov 03, 2013 10:43 pm

KBFitz wrote:Now posted on the JFK 50 Mile home page http://www.jfk50mile.org/:

Team Declarations are now being accepted.

Want to declare a team? If so, who wants to be Captain?

we need a captain? I vote for Tim or Martin. Gonna need them to drag Trevor and me along.

T Miller Mon Nov 04, 2013 10:04 am

mountandog wrote:
KBFitz wrote:Now posted on the JFK 50 Mile home page http://www.jfk50mile.org/:

Team Declarations are now being accepted.

Want to declare a team? If so, who wants to be Captain?
we need a captain? I vote for Tim or Martin. Gonna need them to drag Trevor and me along.

yes, we want to declare a team. I'll be the captain if no one else wants to.

How many people do we have?
Michael
Trevor
Schuey
Tim
Wendy
Alex
Vivian

Is there anyone that I've missed?

Michele "1L" Keane Mon Nov 04, 2013 10:47 am

Sara Jane, Chris, Lisa and I are your cheerleaders!!! But since Jerry won't be there, we won't have anyone in their cheer outfit.

T Miller Mon Nov 04, 2013 12:25 pm

Michele \"1L" Keane wrote:Sara Jane, Chris, Lisa and I are your cheerleaders!!! But since Jerry won't be there, we won't have anyone in their cheer outfit.

woot woot

mountandog Mon Nov 04, 2013 1:02 pm

T Miller wrote:
mountandog wrote:
KBFitz wrote:Now posted on the JFK 50 Mile home page http://www.jfk50mile.org/:

Team Declarations are now being accepted.

Want to declare a team? If so, who wants to be Captain?
we need a captain? I vote for Tim or Martin. Gonna need them to drag Trevor and me along.
yes, we want to declare a team. I'll be the captain if no one else wants to.

How many people do we have?
Michael
Trevor
Schuey
Tim
Wendy
Alex
Vivian

Is there anyone that I've missed?

I thought there was a third female???????? Is Alex still in, I thought he had an injury??????

T Miller Mon Nov 04, 2013 2:27 pm

mountandog wrote:
T Miller wrote:
mountandog wrote:
KBFitz wrote:Now posted on the JFK 50 Mile home page http://www.jfk50mile.org/:

Team Declarations are now being accepted.

Want to declare a team? If so, who wants to be Captain?
we need a captain? I vote for Tim or Martin. Gonna need them to drag Trevor and me along.
yes, we want to declare a team. I'll be the captain if no one else wants to.

How many people do we have?
Michael
Trevor
Schuey
Tim
Wendy
Alex
Vivian

Is there anyone that I've missed?
I thought there was a third female???????? Is Alex still in, I thought he had an injury??????

I don't know about Alex but I know that Sara Jane was the third female but unfortunately she is out for this year's race.

KBFitz Mon Nov 04, 2013 2:38 pm

mountandog wrote:I thought there was a third female???????? Is Alex still in, I thought he had an injury??????

Sara Jane is registered, but will not run. She joins the crew.
Alex is registered, but will not run. Alex. You would be welcome in the crew.

No harm in signing up all registered runners: Michael Young, Trevor Young, Martin Schumacher, Tim Miller, Wendy Miller, Vivian Adkins, Alex and Sara Baldwin.

Crew can support with change of shoes, food/hydration, pace/accompaniment. I have found it helpful to change from trail shoes to marathon shoes at the end of the Appalachian Trail in Weverton (Mile 15.5). But all runners are different in this score. The event has plenty of aid stations with all manner of treats and replacement fluids ... more than satisfying needs ... as long as you carry a wide-mouth bottle. We will work up a crew plan later this week.

I also second Whitney's advice above. One is well-advised to mind one's exertion level on the way up South Mountain. It is entirely possible (and seductive) to really enjoy yourself on the Appalachian Trail because you're fresh. But you'll pay for it in spades after Antietam (27.1) on your way to 38 Special.

Michele "1L" Keane Mon Nov 04, 2013 2:40 pm

I'm flying in on Friday, Kevin, so I won't be able to carry much with me; however, since I will obviously have a car and time - I can certainly pick up stuff that might be needed. Just let me know! I'm looking forward to it as well.

Julie Mon Nov 04, 2013 7:31 pm

Some year I so want to do this. Excited for you all.

T Miller Wed Nov 06, 2013 11:22 am

okay, I'm sending in our team information. Team name is going to be "365 Runners" unless someone else has a better name.

I've included everyone that was mentioned above,

Martin
Tim
Wendy
Sara Jane
Vivian
Alex
Michael
Trevor

Last Chance, did I miss anyone?

mountandog Sun Nov 10, 2013 7:48 pm

good name. I think you got everyone, although I'm expecting a couple of scratches. I think Trevor might back out. Hasn't been able to get the training in due to work and calf injury. He might still come for either support or giving it a 10 hour jog, walk effort. We'll see.

mountandog Sun Nov 10, 2013 7:55 pm

by the way, are there any 365 runners post race festivities planned, either for Sat or Sun?

Alex Kubacki Wed Nov 13, 2013 9:39 am

The injury will keep me from running this. Not happy about that. I won't be able to make it down. Hope everyone has a great race and look forward to seeing all or some of you in Boston.

T Miller Wed Nov 13, 2013 10:18 am

Alex Kubacki wrote:The injury will keep me from running this. Not happy about that. I won't be able to make it down. Hope everyone has a great race and look forward to seeing all or some of you in Boston.

I'm sorry to hear that. I wish you an injury free training cycle for Boston.

Sara Jane Mon Nov 18, 2013 5:30 pm

Disappointed about the freakish injury I've been rehabbing most of the fall and that I can't join you guys on the starting line. Excited to pace and crew and cheer, though!

See y'all this weekend.

Julie Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:59 pm

I wish you all a great time this weekend!

Mark B Thu Nov 21, 2013 12:32 am

Sorry about the freakish injury, SJ. That stinks!

Hope everybody has a great weekend and posts fabulous race (and crewing) reports. With photos. Gotta have photos!

Karma rockets set on transcontinental trajectory!

Jerry Fri Nov 22, 2013 11:31 am

Go have fun!

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